Allods Online Forum

Astral breath is one of the best AOE in this game, but as Dala said, its CD ruins it

this skill was one of the main reasons why i wanted to get the codex carnifex, because with the timeabsorption this skill gets a normal CD so its can be regularly used for groups of weak mobs

pull (AstralCurse gets applied), wob, pulse(AstralCurse triggers and gets applied again),AB(AstralCurse triggers), finish

also, as for shit AOE, with this combination even without AB psi can do GREAT aoe dps
actually with WOB psi is similar to warrior with his AOE

one more hint: if in a group of mobs and you have WOB with rubies, dont cast it again on the same mob because you will lose some seconds of damage
better:

1 target A,
2 use wob,
3 target B
4 use wob
5 return to 1

if you use temporal acceleration you should change between 3 targets to maximize DPS

Alıntı sahibi "Dala"

It's still good for solo (especially levelling)

Keep in mind that new player doesnt have high runes or cs items most likely; and it's hard to aoe level even as reinc, so.
At level 30+, when ppl unlock p5, which new player won't have either (unless he goes yolo cash from the start), aoe leveling will be pure agony.

Alıntı sahibi "ImaMania"

Alıntı sahibi "Dala"

It's still good for solo (especially levelling)

Keep in mind that new player doesnt have high runes or cs items most likely; and it's hard to aoe level even as reinc, so.
At level 30+, when ppl unlock p5, which new player won't have either (unless he goes yolo cash from the start), aoe leveling will be pure agony.

Actually I have never ever experienced the difference patronage 5 makes so I wouldn't know, they introduced subscription server around the same time p5 came to EU. Wall of Blades was very good on subscription server.

Back when I levelled on the f2p (level 47 patch) wall of blades couldn't even be precast and I still successfully and effectively used it for aoe levelling (and later AoE grinding for gold which was a real blast) only having level 4 runes at the time.

areas where WOB is useful for weak new players (for example only levelgear, no improvements from CS at all, runes 211 111):

every area until eljune, from eljune mobs become harder and aoe first require getting appropriate strenght (repgear for example)
coba is extremely hard for a new player, but coldberg will be easy again and aoe will be possible for everyone
dragonring will usually again offer no use for AOE due to powerful mobs
yazes again will offer opportunities where you can profit a lot from aoe
gipat not really
kirah some parts
isle of revelation = no AOE
next areas depend on strenght but mostly no AOE
pearlring will be next area where aoe will be of use in some parts
irdrich partially
umoira has some opportunities (but not too much)
and ferris offers almost no AOE situations at all for weak new players

so there are lots of situations for this spell, and een in 1 vs 1 due to precast it can offer a good dmgburst
once you are in posession of all the characterimprovements almost the whole leveling becomes an AOEparty

@Dala
did WOB had some disarm-effect at this time or was this even earlier?
because i read somewhere original description of his spell was something like "the psi moves the weapons of the enemies and forms a storm with them"

Alıntı sahibi "ALLODS-ONLINE-PLAYER"

@Dala
did WOB had some disarm-effect at this time or was this even earlier?
because i read somewhere original description of his spell was something like "the psi moves the weapons of the enemies and forms a storm with them"

Disarm effect was pre-gipat (year 2010). WoB was a self-buff with like even longer cast time than it has now and the aoe was around you.

buy the cs item and you get all the racials so chosse what looks best to you

Alıntı sahibi "little_finger"

Hey,sorry i took so late to answer, there was so much to read xD
I thought about u all said and i was wondering, a build like this would be ok for endgame? I really don't want to screw it up, reset is expensive. I don't know how many talents/ruby are available without using boutique stuff, so i would like to know if someone can tell me.
For pve: http://en.allodswiki.ru/calc/#!6!313....…EG!mrwsb/MBALLI
For pvp: http://en.allodswiki.ru/calc/#!6!323....…XQC!edd/CCIBXVG

This would definitely not be ok. Not even close. There's three rubies you should avoid like a plague in pretty much any build, those are:

• Tricky Mind - this one is actually harmful, you are better off with empty cell instead. Even r1 already completely destroys your damage against Will Suppression targets. CC-focused builds are dead since 5.0.
  
• Outsmarted - negligible gain for 3 rubies
  
• Gravikinesis - negligible gain for 3 rubies (at least you didn't take that one)
  

PvE build without pyro is doomed to fail. Choke isn't worth it in PvE. Erase Memory rubies aren't worth it in PvE.
Anger Management rubies aren't worth it, because of how far they are.
Cruel Master rubies are must have even though they are similarly far, they are simply too good to not take.
Hypnosis r3 is must have now after they fixed it in 6.0.
Not taking Twin or Master of Illusion for PvP is just unbelievably wrong. Same with Mind Fire.
Telekinesis is nice to have but not must.
Depression r1 or r2 is enough, r3 is huge overkill.

Alıntı sahibi "little_finger"

Hey,sorry i took so late to answer, there was so much to read xD
I thought about u all said and i was wondering, a build like this would be ok for endgame? I really don't want to screw it up, reset is expensive. I don't know how many talents/ruby are available without using boutique stuff, so i would like to know if someone can tell me.
For pve: http://en.allodswiki.ru/calc/#!6!313....…EG!mrwsb/MBALLI
For pvp: http://en.allodswiki.ru/calc/#!6!323....…XQC!edd/CCIBXVG
Oh, and... i don't know what race to choose, since i read mixed oppinions about the racials in this forum,i'm a bit confused of what is best xD

~suggestions~

are you sur you want astral pve dps? pyro pve dps would be higher

pve:
no sharp incursion
irrational fear questionable skill
take superficial trance
if you have cruel master rethink taking extrasensory gift
chronokinesis = no
temp. accel -> taake only R1
use rank 1 twin
get astral curse & moral trauma & loop of time
dont get tricky mind! it lowers your dmg on sharp incursion target! (better take empty ruby)
why you have an empty ruby in 1st grid?


like this
http://en.allodswiki.ru/calc/#!6!313...1…unahgbd/AJRUAPD
if you have rubies left use for calculating mind

Alıntı sahibi "little_finger"

Lol is good i asked then... i guess i will go pyro for pve then. Fixing what u ppl said in the astral build is ok or i would need to change it all?
PS:i didn't noticed the empty one,ty o-o

if you are not happy with pyro for some reason go astral dps, better have a bit lower dps and joy while playing than beeing higher dps with no fun at all...
before i had SVOD i had no pyro-spec at all since astralbuilds were more fun to me
(same goes for choke, its controversary among psis, i like it even if i sometimes lose a lot of potential dps due to beeing interrupted)

if you cange the mentioned things in astralbuild i think it would serve you well

and for pvp, Dala already mentioned the important things

Alıntı sahibi "ALLODS-ONLINE-PLAYER"

if you are not happy with pyro for some reason go astral dps, better have a bit lower dps and joy while playing than beeing higher dps with no fun at all...

It's not "a bit", it's very significant.

Alıntı sahibi "Dala"

Alıntı sahibi "little_finger"

Hey,sorry i took so late to answer, there was so much to read xD
I thought about u all said and i was wondering, a build like this would be ok for endgame? I really don't want to screw it up, reset is expensive. I don't know how many talents/ruby are available without using boutique stuff, so i would like to know if someone can tell me.
For pve: http://en.allodswiki.ru/calc/#!6!313....…EG!mrwsb/MBALLI
For pvp: http://en.allodswiki.ru/calc/#!6!323....…XQC!edd/CCIBXVG

This would definitely not be ok. Not even close. There's three rubies you should avoid like a plague in pretty much any build, those are:

• Tricky Mind - this one is actually harmful, you are better off with empty cell instead. Even r1 already completely destroys your damage against Will Suppression targets. CC-focused builds are dead since 5.0.
  
• Outsmarted - negligible gain for 3 rubies
  
• Gravikinesis - negligible gain for 3 rubies (at least you didn't take that one)
  

PvE build without pyro is doomed to fail. Choke isn't worth it in PvE. Erase Memory rubies aren't worth it in PvE.
Anger Management rubies aren't worth it, because of how far they are.
Cruel Master rubies are must have even though they are similarly far, they are simply too good to not take.
Hypnosis r3 is must have now after they fixed it in 6.0.
Not taking Twin or Master of Illusion for PvP is just unbelievably wrong. Same with Mind Fire.
Telekinesis is nice to have but not must.
Depression r1 or r2 is enough, r3 is huge overkill.

i think you should really tone down the condescending tone when giving psi tips on forum, i guess you lebeled yourself as this amazing psi that play for years (just like myself, but i don't use that as an argument), you do not know everything and your opinion is not above all.

First of all, i don't know how can you say that Choke isn't worth in pve astral build, maybe you don't know how to use it? 2nd of all, how can u say that "outsmarted" ruby we should avoid like plague since it stacks a lot easier/faster than shattered nerves and one stack does more damage than 1 stack of shattered nerves (outsmarted usually stacks at 5 everytime that i use choke, while shattered stacks usually at 1/2/3 before using dest, obviously keeping an eye on moral trauma debuff).

Pyro build can be very restricted/limited sometimes and can be very annoying also 'cause you'll find yourself using psychic shock/venom a lot since it hits a lot easier than casting pyro. Sometimes you can't cast pyro, or delay because of damage that you receive, or it's interrupted, or you have to move. Temp accel. is a must on a pyro build tho.

I compared both of dps builds and pyro dps build compared to astral is higher, just a bit higher. i prefer astral because i think it's more versatile, and it's only going to fail as you said if you take these tips like "avoid outsmarted" and such. With astral build you have "moral trauma" damage, with pyro you will only get that if you spend a lot of points on useless rubies or blank spots (a good build requires optmization, and a build with many blank spots it's not optimized), there's outsmarted on astral build too, tenacious mind to increase choke dmg, twin at rank 1 is a must so you can cast choke mostly without interruption (while using astral body rank 2 when the twin is gone or if you know you will be hit or something), astral build you have shattered nerves, on pyro build you don't have this ruby (since only astral venom/psychic shock stacks shattered nerves...well, you can have shattered at rank 3 with venom at rank 3 as dala said there were on her/his pyro build, but not on my pyro build, after all i don't want to be a psi with rank 1 mental pulse and tk pull/rank 2 concentration/no astral breath/or whatever just to do a unsure combo such as pyro/venom/dest with a combo trick that only works everytime on dala's character). I really don't think it's a good move to sacrifice rubies/points to lvlup astral venom rank 3 on a Pyro build, plus i have concentration at rank 3 with all rubies, 1min cooldown, that's a lot better than rank 2 without sht, and you can't max thoughtful spirits either on your pyro build and that helps for DPS on an astral build. so, resume: with temp accel pyro shines greatly, otherwise/while on cd, or whatever, not so much.

Alıntı sahibi "lublur"

i think you should really tone down the condescending tone when giving psi tips on forum, i guess you lebeled yourself as this amazing psi that play for years (just like myself, but i don't use that as an argument), you do not know everything and your opinion is not above all.

If you followed closely enough, you'd see that I admitted making a fairly big mistake regarding how pyro additional hit works recently. A condescending person would never do that.

Alıntı sahibi "lublur"

First of all, i don't know how can you say that Choke isn't worth in pve astral build

Here's my thought process:
Choke could be good for PvE astral build.
PvE astral build is just sub-par to pyro build every time (besides solo activities, but that's not what's understood as "endgame"), therefore:
Choke could be good in an inferior build.

The only advantage PvE astral build could ever have over pyro is during movement and during movement Choke is useless and therefore Outsmarted is useless too.
You said it yourself:

Alıntı sahibi "lublur"

Pyro build can be very restricted/limited sometimes and can be very annoying also 'cause you'll find yourself using psychic shock/venom a lot since it hits a lot easier than casting pyro. Sometimes you can't cast pyro, or delay because of damage that you receive, or it's interrupted, or you have to move.

By extension this applies to Choke, it's even worse there because to use Choke you need to stand still for 8 seconds. To use Pyro you need to stand still between 1.9 and 2.5 seconds depending on how many Pyrophrenia stacks you have.

Alıntı sahibi "lublur"

With astral build you have "moral trauma" damage, with pyro you will only get that if you spend a lot of points on useless rubies or blank spots (a good build requires optmization, and a build with many blank spots it's not optimized)

As sad as it might sound, the psi rubies are so terribly imbalanced some of them are barely better than blank spots while others are so good that getting to them justifies taking the blank. There's simply nothing else out there to spend 5 rubies on that will yield overall better result than going for Moral Trauma over 2 blank.

Alıntı sahibi "lublur"

after all i don't want to be a psi with rank 1 mental pulse and tk pull/rank 2 concentration/no astral breath/or whatever just to do a unsure combo such as pyro/venom/dest with a combo trick that only works everytime on dala's character)

I might have not said it in any of my earlier posts, but by "endgame PvE build" I mean a build for content where you have a tank. In those cases the need to use Mental Pulse is close to none.

As for Astral Breath, it's not something that can save the day ever, it's only use is on every 3rd to 4th pack of those "Look at me!" dps meter moments while doing zero challenge content. That doesn't justify spending talent points on in my book.

Alıntı sahibi "lublur"

I really don't think it's a good move to sacrifice rubies/points to lvlup astral venom rank 3 on a Pyro build

This is correct, r2 is more than enough in pyro/venom/destab build.

Alıntı sahibi "lublur"

you can't max thoughtful spirits either on your pyro build and that helps for DPS on an astral build.

R2 is enough for me, at least when using green tears. It might change with blue perma tear or epic/legend tears from private allod.

as I said, i almost always got 5 stacks of outsmarted by using choke, even with only one hit it's enough to do just as much or superior damage than Dest, with 5 hits choke becomes like first dps on dps meter and outshines dest.

sometimes that I do like 3 hits with choke and have to move is enough to do a lot more damage than one hit of dest, using only 1 stack of concentration. endgame also applies to solo stuff, it's not only for group purposes, pyro build kinda sucks on witch/trojan for example, or wellebell farm, tka-rik, and can be very annoying on islands run too in many situations and bosses, in my opinion. Some bosses that you constantly needs to move and get hitten (like Trojan), you cast choke while you are under defensive skills, even without defensive skills you can have 2-3 hits and it's more enough to outshine dest, speacially with outsmarted stacks right after casting choke, on trojan with pyro build is just awful, defensive skills doesn't help a lot and you will have to constantly use venom. So for that reason i prefer Astral.

in your process, you think that choke with outsmarted is not worth while 3 rubies for shattered nerves can stack a lot hard than outsmarted and does less damage than outsmarted (usually 1 stack for dest on your pyro/venom combo), hmm...right

for astral breath, there's more situations than just "hey look at me"

Alıntı sahibi "lublur"

endgame also applies to solo stuff, it's not only for group purposes, pyro build kinda sucks on witch/trojan for example, or wellebell farm, tka-rik, and can be very annoying on islands run too in many situations and bosses, in my opinion. Some bosses that you constantly needs to move and get hitten (like Trojan), you cast choke while you are under defensive skills, even without defensive skills you can have 2-3 hits and it's more enough to outshine dest, speacially with outsmarted stacks right after casting choke, on trojan with pyro build is just awful, defensive skills doesn't help a lot and you will have to constantly use venom. So for that reason i prefer Astral.

For all those situations I use my PvP build. They aren't really something you can "fail" with it, while things like s9 (on p2p at least) are definitely something that can be failed due to insufficient dps.

Alıntı sahibi "lublur"

in your process, you think that choke with outsmarted is not worth while 3 rubies for shattered nerves can stack a lot hard than outsmarted and does less damage than outsmarted (usually 1 stack for dest on your pyro/venom combo), hmm...right

Problem is any movement and you won't get those stacks. Stacks of Shattered Nerves you can always build up.

Alıntı sahibi "Dala"

Problem is any movement and you won't get those stacks. Stacks of Shattered Nerves you can always build up.

You still got the stacks, you may don't get 5 of them every single time, but definately most of the times you will get them. According to your build, shattered doesn't stack up more than 1 or 2 stacks. lol

Alıntı sahibi "lublur"

You still got the stacks, you may don't get 5 of them every single time, but definately most of the times you will get them. According to your build, shattered doesn't stack up more than 1 or 2 stacks. lol

Shattered Nerves are by no means main damage source, it just serves to minimize dps loss on movement.

Now think about how often can you apply Outsmarted stacks and how often Shattered Nerves, Choke has 25s cooldown. It's almost twice as much time to apply full stacks (assuming you don't get interrupted), and the additional damage per stack of Shattered Nerves is only slightly worse than a stack of Outsmarted, certainly nowhere close to twice as much.

Main problem with Choke is that you need to spend like 8 rubies to make it as good as other skills are with less investment and Choke still has very limited use. If it had like half the cooldown or was usable while moving it might have been worth it.

I hope they make it good and worth it for main rotation in 7.0, like the old days of every tick doing more damage than the previous.

Alıntı sahibi "Dala"

Alıntı sahibi "lublur"

You still got the stacks, you may don't get 5 of them every single time, but definately most of the times you will get them. According to your build, shattered doesn't stack up more than 1 or 2 stacks. lol

Shattered Nerves are by no means main damage source, it just serves to minimize dps loss on movement.

Now think about how often can you apply Outsmarted stacks and how often Shattered Nerves, Choke has 25s cooldown. It's almost twice as much time to apply full stacks (assuming you don't get interrupted), and the additional damage per stack of Shattered Nerves is only slightly worse than a stack of Outsmarted, certainly nowhere close to twice as much.

Main problem with Choke is that you need to spend like 8 rubies to make it as good as other skills are with less investment and Choke still has very limited use. If it had like half the cooldown or was usable while moving it might have been worth it.

I hope they make it good and worth it for main rotation in 7.0, like the old days of every tick doing more damage than the previous.

It's 22s cooldown, since Solid Grasp is on the way of Moral Trauma, 3 rubies that on pyro build you would use on blank spots/Exodus.
1 stack is slightly worse compared to 1 stack of outsmarted, at 5 stacks the difference is higher.

On an astral build you have enough rubies to get Outsmarted and all of others dmg rubies, so many rubies for choke is not a problem since you spend a lot more rubies to make Pyro work (something like 20 rubies to get all of pyro rubies), so what is ~8 rubies anyway since if you don't use them, you'll get what? defensive rubies? No...

Choke is worth getting on an astral build, that's my opinion, so don't come here stating your opinion like if it was above all.

ok now where iam psi since yesterday cuz wanted to test this class a bit its actually a nice dps class also have to prove dala true where pyro,venom and desta is the best dps i could notice fo far but why i see no spectral assasin anywhere? its DEFENETLY worth it! its 3 place in dps if you uphold it !

about 35% pyro
about 25% desta
about 20% assasin
about 15%astral venom
5% for moral crisis,charm of light etc

makes in singletarget quite a bit of damage O.o

also in aoe psi is not bad but manahungry in aoe grps simply activate temporal and cast on everymob wall of blades (i even have the casttime reduce rubees cuz i dont use choke) and when all temporal is running out go for astral breath cuz easily score 1 place in aoe like this (ok but will have to regg mana more often

but ofc has an disadvantage like this so lets say

ultrashort aoe time = not good unless you want to waste astral breath
middle aoe time = super psi will be hard to beat
long aoe time = bad psi will run out of mana (but didnt test yet how much astral curse will inflict when i use pull and kick more in aoe grps)